Wednesday, August 3, 2011

An Unsuitable Job For A Man

Really interesting piece in the Guardian today about the current state of British pop music and the fact that the five best selling albums in the UK are all by women. The Guardian wonders if this is a cyclical thing or the sign of a sea change in British musical tastes. In fact the Guardian even undersells the case a little because if you look at the British album chart you'll see that there is only one male vocalist in the top 12 best selling albums. Obviously Amy Winehouse is only there because of the recent tragedy of her death - but like Winehouse there are many powerful female singers who, crucially, write and perform their own material: Adele, Lady Gaga, Katy Perry and others like Beyonce and Rihanna who have co-writing credits.
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I think it's a great thing. As I've gotten older I've found it much harder to listen to male vocalists. Singing pop songs seems like an utterly ridiculous job for a man and whenever I see some bloke doing it with his hair gelled back and wearing a shiny jacket, I'm a bit embarrassed for him. (I still can't believe I used to think Thom Yorke was cool.) It's even worse if you're fronting a band or if you're a country and western singer. When Adele or Dolly Parton or Lady Gaga or whoever is up there belting her heart out you can emotionally buy into the whole experience but grown men shouldn't be doing that should they? Men should be out fixing the fence or chopping wood for winter or whittling things not singing songs about how they feel in front of strangers. 
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I think this is also why there are so few African American singers under 30. Plenty or rappers yes, singers no. African American culture is always about five to ten years ahead of mainstream culture so maybe we're all just catching up? Who knows.
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When I used to play Dungeons and Dragons (this is the point in the post where my wife stops reading) of all the characters you could be: ranger, fighter, thief, magician, cleric, illusionist etc. the lamest of all was the bard. Nobody wanted to be a bloody bard! Even in the nerdy world of D&D it was just not a suitable job for a man. Still isn't.

75 comments:

seana said...

Good thing Frank Sinatra isn't still around or he'd probably come over and clean your clock.

adrian said...

Seana

What a great story though, getting your clock cleaned by Sinatra...

Have you ever heard the Sinatra stories Don Rickles tells? Some really good ones.

Frankie said...

My Ipod reflects this trend. I have always preferred female vocalists.
Think you are being harsh on your sex though, i mean are you forgetting R Kelly-talented WEE singer and um..James Blunt who fits his cockney rhyming slang of..

What id like to know is what does a Bard represent in D&D. I may have known a few Bards in my time.

John McFetridge said...

I think it was Harrison Ford who said the key to being an actor is believing that putting on make-up and playing house is a perfectly reasonable thing for a grown man to do.

But I don't think it's the actual singing, I think it's the trying to make a living from it. A little while ago I saw Deep Purple in concert and now that there's no attempt to sell a record and no one's really there to make a lot of money or worry about their position in the charts or getting radio airplay or any of that it was really just some 'blokes' (I think is the term) crashing around making music and jokes about sore backs and going to bed early.

Even grown men can have some fun.

adrian said...

Frankie

I dont really remember what a bard could do but I think it was pretty crap. I dont think a storm giant was ever that impressed when you pulled out your flute or mandolin and starting playing it at him.

adrian said...

John

If people want to do keep doing it, fine. It is odd though. Especially for someone of Ian Gillan's advancing years. But then Gillan is an odd fish. Interesting, yes. Odd definitely.

Cary Watson said...

I'll go further. No man should have any interest in music once he's married. I was only ever interested in music as a conversational gambit with women in bars and clubs. Once I was married, poof!, no more interest in music...or dancing. And the only male singer any man should listen to is Tom Jones. This is because many scientific studies undertaken at UNLV have shown that if an erection could sing, it would sound exactly like Tom Jones.

seana said...

Singing is probably something like bright plumage on birds. But on the other hand, I know of three garage bands of friends who are all well over forty, and they seem to be having the time of their lives. I've heard two of them and they weren't bad at all.

Matt said...

Adrian, this article may have been written for you. I don't agree with it but at least there is a Robert Heinlein quote.

http://www.dungeonmastering.com/gaming-life/why-bard-is-the-greatest-class-ever

Bards were never chosen in any of the campaigns I played in either.

Peter Rozovsky said...

I dunno; one of the things I’ve been listening to to keep my mind off work is Johnny Hartman’s tribute album to John Coltrane. And Frank Sinatra, of whom I am generally no fan, recorded an album with Antonio Carlos Jobim that is very much worth a listen. Sinatra’s respect for Jobim comes through very clearly.

But that's OK, I guess. Hartman, Jobim, and Sinatra are all dead, not to mention those Cuban guys, of whom I posted a clip here recently. But even if all were still alive, they would be different. That's real singing, not shite.
======================
Detectives Beyond Borders
"Because Murder Is More Fun Away From Home"
http://www.detectivesbeyondborders.blogspot.com/

Peter Rozovsky said...

A few months ago I was thinking about Stevie Wonder and Michael Jackson. Michael Jackson sings "Get up, baby! Show me what you can do! ... Shake it!" on "ABC," and you just want to pat him in the head and say, "Aww!"

Stevie Wonder sings "I Was Made to Love Her," and you say, "Wow! I didn't know a kid could sing like that."
======================
Detectives Beyond Borders
"Because Murder Is More Fun Away From Home"
http://www.detectivesbeyondborders.blogspot.com/

adrian mckinty said...

Cary

UNLV may have a vested interest in promoting Tom Jones.

Walked around there once. Very nice campus there. They've landscaped it as a desert in the city to save water which is kind of cool.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

Yeah thats fine. I encourage people to sing for themselves in their basement or their garage, but it seems silly singing in front of a bunch of strangers, especially songs about leaving your baby etc.

adrian mckinty said...

Matt

Bards are indie he says. Thats supposed to be a good thing?

I am unconvinced. And does the Heinlein quote mention singing? No. He says "write a sonnet". Very different thing. Reciting poetry is cool.

To get into the Fianna, Finn McCool's band of warriors you had to recite flawlessly lines of ancient Irish poetry while nine men threw spears at you.

Thats cool. Playing the mandolin and prancing around isnt.

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

I have to say when Michael Jackson sings "Billy Jean is not my lover" I am convinced.

dpougher said...

But what about the cool bards such as Warren Zevon or your own Van Morrison? Zevon could write songs about werewolves, psychopaths and sado-masochism but also love songs like Searching for a Heart or hate songs like French Inhaler. And all with ferocious heroin and alcohol addictions. But I admit if you asked me who was the 21st century successor to Van or Warren, I'd struggle to come up with a name.

Peter Rozovsky said...

Peter

I have to say when Michael Jackson sings "Billy Jean is not my lover" I am convinced.


Thinkest thou the boy doth protest too much?

adrian said...

David

Did you ever see this version of Lawyers, Guns and Money from the Old Grey Whistle Test? Nice work on the 12 string guitar.

I've got a little a Zevon tribute in a couple of my books.

adrian said...

Peter

Yes.

Lew Archer. said...

The music biz is definitely a mess these days.
When I was a kid all the guys wanted to be guitarists or singers, because they got all the women.
I can hardly bear listening to any new music. I think all the POP stuff sucks. Give me some Neil Young or Elton John, or Lou Reed and I'm happy.
Criminy, I'm getting to be an old fart.

Peter Rozovsky said...

A 12-string always sounds good, but Zevon was no guitarist. He can’t play, so he relies on the instrument’s sound. And I like the song.
======================
Detectives Beyond Borders
"Because Murder Is More Fun Away From Home"
http://www.detectivesbeyondborders.blogspot.com/

adrian mckinty said...

Lew

You want Lou Reed?

You got it mate:

My sixth favourite Lou Reed song.

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

Wow you're picky.

How about an old favourite.

Peter Rozovsky said...

Picky -- guitar. Nice one!

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

And they say a man who would pick a pun would pick a pocket.

seana said...

If we let Adrian and Peter get on a pun roll, well, it's worse than singing.

Actually, though, I am really just not buying this whole argument at all. Guys who sing the right songs at the right time get the girls. Whether other guys groove to it is irrelevant, except to the extent they are able to copy their moves for themselves.

I'm not against rap, but it's kind of like the Republicans and Democrats and the debt ceiling. Ignoring your true audience for a battle with your brothers is always a mistake.

seana said...

Also, An Unsuitable Job for a Woman was actually about a woman and a job that was eminently suitable for her, as it turned out.

Peter Rozovsky said...

Seana, Adrian is just stringing you along with the puns. He'll be back to his usual high seriousness shortly.

Meanwhile, did you see the news story about the theory that a second moon crashed into our moon a billion years ago? The planetary scientist who wrote the study is from UC Santa Cruz.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

Yeah it was an ironic title and one of her best books in my opinion.

I still dont think they should be doing it even if they do get the girls. Its just silly. The very worst offenders these days are those New Country singers with their absurd black shiny hats and their macho posturing all the while singing songs about their favourite dog or their girl or the American flag - its pathetic.

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

Actually the they who says that line about the pun is Stephen Maturin from the Aubrey-Maturin books. You really need to read Master and Commander, or better yet listen to the audio version narrated by Patrick Tull.

Peter Rozovsky said...

Yeah, someone had to have said that.

I'll put Master and Commander on the to-read list.

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

Dont be put off by the movie.

Zero percent of the book's content went into the film.

seana said...

I hadn't seen that story, Peter, but will look for it. Santa Cruz has always had a pretty amazing astronomy program, even before it got deeply involved with NASA.

Okay, I know this dates me, but what about Bruce Springsteen?

I don't know any really young singers, except Justin Bieber, who doesn't really advance my cause.

Peter Rozovsky said...

Adrian, I've never seen the movie.

Seana, if you think mentioning Bruce Springsteen dates you, but what about all the ones I mentioned? I don't think a single one of them is still alive.

Peter Rozovsky said...

Philadelphia has traditionally been a home of male singers, from Mario Lanza through Bobby Rydell, doo-wop, Harold Melvin and the Bluenotes through Billy Paul, Boyz II Men and the infuriatingly named John Legend.

seana said...

I wasn't really a Sinatra fan myself, but my sisters doubled back and got into the Rat Pack and some of the crooners.

I actually am not a true Springsteen fan either,but I lived in a household of them for awhile. I like his music, though, and understand his appeal.

I really never thought of a bard as a singer. I think of him more as Shakespeare.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

Springsteen is the case in point. A multi millionaire 60 year old squeezing into tight jeans and singing about Jersey guys in tank tops down the autoshop. Its lame.

John McFetridge said...

Neil Young seems to make it work, though.

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

Dont forget Hall and Oates - now they're not embarrassing at all are they?

seana said...

I'm not talking about who he is now, I'm talking about how he started out.

I actually just saw something on Rachel Maddow that supports my argument, but it isn't up on line yet. It's a very appealing guy who works on the new subway line who takes time during his lunch break to sing some old tunes in apology for all the noise the residents have had to endure. If he isn't married, he will be soon. I mean, if he's not gay. And if he is gay, he's in New York, and he could be married soon anyway.

adrian mckinty said...

John

I dont know.

I still prefer Dolly's version.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

Even back then...

I like the Nebraska album and Darkness on the Edge of Town but the rest is a bit much.

seana said...

Hmm.

adrian mckinty said...

seana

No man could get away with this:

Dolly Parton Little Sparrow

or this

Regina Spektor brooklyn accent and singing in Russian

especially not this

adele live at the brits

Peter Rozovsky said...

Yeah, their cover of "You've Lost That Loving Feeling" is one of the less necessary recordings in pop-music history.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

Although I do like Louis and Ella together, you'd have to be crazy not to I suppose...

Porgy and Bess

Peter Rozovsky said...

I went to hear Hilary Davidson read from her novel "The Damage Done" at Sleuth of Baker Street in Toronto, and I found a book on the shelves called "Down By the River."

Neil Young has juice in Ontario.

seana said...

I loved those, so thanks for that. But,then, I'd never say that women shouldn't sing. I will say that Dolly Parton is definitely underrated.

I don't have tons of examples in my head, and I don't really expect to convince but,I'll fight my corner. Here's a young
Brucesteen and
an old Pete Townshend in which I don't think they have anything to be ashamed of.

I was riding the bus home tonight, and a young guy was sitting behind me talking on his cell phone. He started off telling his friend about how he was overworked and tired. And then they somehow got to talking about some girl, and the guy said, "Oh. You know I've been majorly bummed out because I thought she didn't want to talk to me."

I really don't see why young men should sing about feelings any less than young women do, as they quite obviously feel them. At least, that's my impression working with and riding the bus with a hell of a lot of them.

dpougher said...

I liked Billy Bob Thornton's little tribute to Warren Zevon, just before he died.
It's at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbwWiffSRRA
and yeah, I'll get around to doing dynamic links one of these days.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

Well I've been to see Bruce a couple of times so I'm not going to put the man down too hard. And I'm pretty sure that he lives on the Jersey to this day which is a good thing.

One of the times I saw him was at Villa Park...

adrian mckinty said...

David

Wait a minute, the drummer for the Black Crowes is an Arsenal fan? How did that happen?

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

As long as Mr Young will remember that a Southern Man dont need him around anyhow...

or something like that.

Peter Rozovsky said...

I think Springsteen has lived in California for quite a number of years, actually.

adrian mckinty said...

Peter

Well thats depressing. When I think of music LA is the last place that comes to mind.

seana said...

Although there is absolutely nothing wrong with living in California, at least Wikipedia has him moving back to New Jersey when he began raising his family.

It's amazing how often Villa Park comes up, considering that outside this blog, I have never heard of it.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

Of course. It's a lovely place. S.F. is my favourite city in the world bar none. I just dont think LA is a good place to be a musician. Esp Beverly Hills.

Peter Rozovsky said...

I should have realized or suspected he'd come back East with his family a couple of years ago, my paper published an article about an area horse show, perhaps the famous Devon Horse Show, that mentioned Springsteen's daughter was competing.

seana said...

Apparently the family owns a horse farm. The son goes to BU, the daughter to Duke.

It's going back east, yes, but hardly a return to working class roots.

Although it's hard to see how that would have been possible anyway.

I love L.A. by the way. It's a hard love to defend, but there it is.

Paul said...

Well,that's a pretty awful video all together.The stuff of nightmares.
I went to see Iron Maiden last night and they were great.Bruce Dickinson is just as good a front-man as he's ever been.Mind you there some rare sights at that concert.I can't remember seeing so many people stuck in the 80's ever.
As for the bard,no one looked good in tights when we played so he was never picked.

Lew Archer said...

Thanks, Adrian.

I just read the post you did on not being able to find a US publisher. Jeez, what is wrong with the market over here? I am going to write a few publishers to make a case for your book.

Ridiculous!

John McFetridge said...

All this talk of Fifty Grand and old fogie rock, somehow this seems appropriate.

seana said...

John, I suppose you think you've proved Adrian's point, but now I believe men should sing more than ever. Especially if they're as goodnatured as these guys.

adrian mckinty said...

Paul

I remember seeing Iron Maiden in Belfast in maybe 1980 when Ian Paisley was leading a protest outside about "the devils music". Funny stuff.

adrian mckinty said...

Lew

As I say thems the breaks. Its a shame though I think its pretty commercial book and would find an audience. Publishers often talk about publishing outsider voices and the like but its all bullshit. For them its what will sell and it seems that anything Nordic will sell these days and if you're Irish you pretty have a strong nostalgia vibe working a la Banville.

adrian mckinty said...

John

That reminds me of this....

Rodrigo and Gabriella playing Wish You Were Here. (neither of them are vocalists but thats ok because everyone knows the words).

It kicks in about 1.30. It gives me chills - happy chills - that we all seem to have this amazing shared culture...

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

It was great until they started singing.

seana said...

Forget branding. I really think that coming out against men singing could be your trademark. Sure, you'll be reviled, but reviled isn't such a bad thing, is it? I mean, in a publicity sense?

I snagged a copy of Deviant yesterday, by the way. Oh man, I am really worried about those cats...

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

I should stress that no actual cats were harmed in the making of the book...

seana said...

I have always liked the poem that starts it off. Or at least for a long time.

adrian mckinty said...

Seana

I have a feeling its going to be one of those books that only me and a few alienated 13 year old boys will like.

Certainly quite a few female bloggers and cat lovers who have read the galley have expressed their horror on good reads. I dont take it personally though. My books are certainly not for everyone.

seana said...

Well, after reading the first chapter, I am not that worried. I mean, I'm worried plotwise, but I am not worried that the author has gone off the deep end. Although this whole rant against male singers does have me wondering.

I am not a huge cat lover, but cats like me. I am not quite sure why. Anyway, I don't really look forward to too many cat casualties. But I'm kind of used to it from mysteries. Cats get done in a lot in them.

Peter Rozovsky said...

Don't forget branding. Take this idea that men should not sing, and run with it. All you need is a slogan: "Shut your mouth and fix the fence" and, in America, an organization with a catchy acronym. I suggest MASS: Men Against Shitty Singing.

seana said...

I can almost sing that, Peter.

But then, I'm a woman.

Peter Rozovsky said...

And what about Stevie Winwood singing "I'm a Man"? Notice that he stopped calling himself "Stevie" and adopted "Steve"? Overcompensation, perhaps?

seana said...

I'd say the title "I'm a man" is the overcompensation part.

Still, sing it, Stevie!